For those who regard Shepard Fairey as but that guy behind Obey and the Obama "Promise" poster, Hulu'south just dropped Obey Behemothic , a feature-length documentary of a rebuttal. Filling in the gaps betwixt the creative person'southward near renowned works with footage from his skater days, run-ins with law, and street fight of a lawsuit with the Associated Printing, the film explores not only the fine art, but the ever-evolving motivations of the human behind it.

Complex got on the phone with Fairey to pick his encephalon about the project, skate fashion, and how propaganda—fifty-fifty the well-intentioned sort like his—has affected our current state of political discourse.

This interview has been edited for clarity and length.

Complex: How'd this Hulu doc come together?
Shepard Fairey: My married woman and I have been collecting video footage for years. Shooting stuff ourselves, collecting from others who've been effectually and washed video interviews with me where the condition was "you tin can employ this for your thing merely, afterwards, we'd like the rights to use information technology in an eventual documentary."

Jennifer Howell, founder of Art of Elysium, a charity I piece of work with a lot, ran into the documentary filmmaker James Moll on the manner to Sundance and he mentioned that he really loved my art and she thought: "he's won an Academy Award. Maybe he can direct this film." He was enthusiastic nigh the idea. They pitched it to Hulu. And then James followed me around for close to two years. The resulting film is a combination of archival footage and documentation of my art pursuits by James.

The idea of having a film nigh my art and career has been thrown around for a few years but I'1000 always so busy it'south never something I pushed to make happen because my life'southward been ongoing.

As someone so connected to skate culture, how do you feel about the current convergence of manner and skatewear brands like Thrasher and Supreme have been elevated to high fashion condition? Has it diminished the underlying "punk" ethos at the middle of skating at all?
Skateboarding'southward had its moments where a Vision streetwear shirt shows upwardly in a Freddy Krueger flick or a picture like Thrashin' or Gleaming the Cube shows up and people are like, "this is the death of skateboarding. The posers are taking over."

I think I'm a lilliputian gentler at this betoken in my life. Being truly into punk rock, skateboarding, street art, or any of the things I'1000 into usually requires a level of commitment or fearlessness, especially with skateboarding. Riding rails or ledges, or ollying down stairs: information technology'southward a committed lifestyle, not just a fashion. So, I can see why it would become irritating to some people for it to become trendy to have a Thrasher or Supreme shirt. Only there's always a risk that, with some of those people that get into information technology for the incorrect reason, it lures them into something that will modify their life.

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Is that what happened for you?

Skateboarding changed my life. Punk rock changed my life. Everything I've been into since and so, in terms of do-information technology-yourself civilization, has really come from that.

When I got into skateboarding in 8th grade, it wasn't because I had the same convictions and then that I have at present. Merely I'm sure it led to me having those convictions. Everyone'due south gotta start somewhere and y'all'll never be able to remove the superficial from culture. It'due south only impossible.

Everyone'southward got to get up in the morning time and make up one's mind what to wear, and so information technology can exist a very superficial medium. But information technology doesn't take to exist. I try to brand my clothing line an entry point for discovering the substance of the rest of my work. I don't think in that location'due south anything incorrect with fashion. Hopefully my clothes are a gateway to the other things I do, be it activism or street art. I don't recall that fashion and integrity are mutually sectional.

So, does that mean you're willing to soften your opinion on Justin Bieber and Kanye being allowed to habiliment metal shirts at present?
When Justin Bieber started wearing the Obey bar logo, we discontinued information technology. That was kinda one of the concluding straws. He wasn't the just guy that dictated that decision. Information technology's about longevity. When I look at things that appeal to the lowest common denominator—people who don't dress themselves, but have a stylist, people who don't recall for themselves—I want to grade correct what I'yard doing with my line at that moment, if possible.

Going dorsum to Supreme for a second, equally someone who'southward not merely been involved in copyright battles, merely is also heavily inspired by Barbara Kruger'southward work, what was your reaction to hearing that Supreme had sued her to protect their copyright?

When Justin Bieber started wearing the Obey bar logo, we discontinued it. That was kinda ane of the last straws.

I did hear the response from Barbara but I don't know the exact details of the case. It's so ironic because [Supreme] Clearly copied Barbara Kruger, but like I did. When I made my Obey logo, it was 100 percent an homage to Barbara Kruger'due south work and 0 percent had anything to do with Supreme. When I made the Obey bar logo with a bar beneath the icon face, Supreme had one store and no clothing line that I knew of. They didn't figure into the decision.

I'm embarrassed for them, that they'd become after Barbara Kruger. I don't have anything against Supreme in general. They brand practiced stuff and choose practiced people to collaborate with, but I'm shocked they did this. That's revisionist history of the Stalin/Trump order.

Do you have whatsoever moments from your own career history that didn't pan out as anticipated that you'd do differently if yous had another chance?

In the doc, I talk about the Cianci billboard being something where I don't know if I wouldn't have done it, but I definitely would have done more research. I went into that a little ignorantly equally a prank and didn't think nearly the ripples it would have in the wider community.

And with the Obama poster, afterwards going through that brutal lawsuit, realizing how relatively inexpensively I could've but licensed the photo. I would do that now.

But that doesn't mean I've given up on the principle of fair utilise for other artists. What's inexpensive for me is potentially out of accomplish, financially, for a lot of other artists. Simply similar Puffy shouldn't be the only guy who can afford a sample for a hip-hop song, and that'due south hurt the art form, I feel the aforementioned way about visual art. I desire to advocate for other artists, not just myself.

As someone whose work is about distilling bigger ideas down to unmarried words or images, how do yous feel almost the electric current state of political discourse where nuance seems unwelcomed and propaganda is more overt than ever? Practise you feel at all complicit in usa getting to this point?

I have a conflicted relationship with oversimplified propaganda. On the one mitt, it's what works in a world where there's and so much white noise and people have short attention spans. On the other mitt, with my new evidence, The Damage Show , I'm printing my own newspaper and all the art pieces have a lot of layers of communication in them and I'm trying to make the conversation more than sophisticated rather than less when information technology comes to the sort of subjects I'm tackling.

I accept to authorize that past maxim that I'm likewise very enlightened that in order to get people to expect at something at all, it has to have enough visual dial to reel them in. And then, balancing that concise power with a more nuanced message can be challenging. Just what I do with my website is present the images, then talk about the images, and then accept links that requite fifty-fifty more depth well-nigh the things I'chiliad dealing with. Propaganda wants to simplify things down to "Make America Bully Over again," and that's that. Simply I similar my art to office as a gateway to a deeper chat.

The trouble is, you can't control the audience. Not anybody in the audience is going to be inspired to await deeper. And when I look at some of the comments on my social media stuff, they clearly haven't read the iii sentences below the visual. But I'm definitely trying to improve advice rather than deteriorate it.

Shepard Fairey Storefront
Image via Ann Summa/Contour past Getty Images

How practice you lot and so deal with instances where the audience goes the extra step across not looking deeper and actually co-opts your art to employ it for evil? Have for instance, Matt Furie having Pepe the frog co-opted by Nazis or racist parodies of your "HOPE" affiche.

It's pretty unavoidable. What I hope—pun intended—is that people wait at the intention behind the original. With the poster or Obey icon, those have been parodied a lot. Every i of those parodies—whether it's a sentiment I hold with or information technology'due south silly or downright mean spirited—refers dorsum to something I did that anyone that feels like looking can understand what my intentions were.

And so, I don't feel like because I fabricated something with expert intentions, and then someone used it with different intentions, that it somehow corrupts what I did in the kickoff identify. In fact, I think had they come up with something original on their ain, an original piece of viral anger, that might actually be scarier than something that'southward a twist on something that had more altruistic aims.

In times like these, where things tin feel hopeless on a daily basis, what has been giving you lot hope?
Immature people seem to exist educating themselves about issues and participating in activism. The challenge, though, is that social media activism is not what brings most change. It tin can exist a component but you lot have to really vote. You lot take to practise things that actually sway politicians: call, petition, march in the street.

I recollect the Trump campaign and presidency is waking upwardly a lot of people who before felt like they didn't demand to participate. But I think the participation need to extend to voting or nosotros're going to see a lot of similar problems in the future.